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Slideouts

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Re: Slideouts
Sun May 17, 2009 12:51 pm


Ahoy, Eagles,

Dan and Hal have it right. You had best NOT just whack into an Eagle and stuff-in slides. The structural beam(s) of an Eagle is the pair of side trusses from the windows to the floors. Very light and strong. The over all skinning provides the torsional structural component required. Easy to get a feel for what you are doing by taping the cover on a shoebox. Pretty ridged. Cut some holes in it, and you quickly see how easy your bus with poorly done slides will 'fold-up' like a shoe box.

And, I DO have the proper credentials to discuss this subject.

I looked at the compromises (and the work-load) of putting slides in my Eagle -01 and went without.

If I were going to do them, the slide outs would be fully structural components which locate on conical structural pins when closed. Fairly unusual, but the F-14 Tomcat Navy Fighter used structural engine cover doors.

This sort of thing requires pretty good 'practice' to be successful, and may well not do well in the hands of the 'great unwashed'. But, if you can build it, you surely should be able to keep it working OK.

As part of the scheme, you had best include a three point leveling system, so that you take the torque off the hull with the slide outs open. That way you can get them closed too.

This structural door method is quite light (but NOT simple), and properly done, you will have full strength and rigidity. The more conventional technique of installing big beams is heavy, and with the differential bending, you don't get anywhere the original rigidity, but you get LOTS of weight.


Enjoy /s/ Bob
Bob Belter Carmel CA ---- Eagle -01 /w/ Cummins M-11/ Roadranger ten speed RTO1110
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Re: Slideouts
Sun May 17, 2009 8:33 pm


I am a newcomer on this board as well and this is my first posted message.

Though I am inclined to dive right into the complexities of structural design, I do not feel seasoned enough to write about something at length and in detail, especially when it becomes part of a formal exchange of strong opinion. My conscience, however, tells me that I must take sides at this point in the discussion.

Having devoted my entire working life to science and engineering and since I am not necessarily a neophyte vis-à-vis the many challenges involving an Eagle conversion, I feel that I must contribute to the debate at least by touching on my own experience and point of view.

I always considered the structure of my Eagle (not always from a metallurgical point of view) an impressive design that reflects successful stress analysis and resulting design techniques and manufacturing methodologies akin to the ones used by the aircraft industry. So, after examining various “supposedly unbeaten” slide-out room implementations at a number of reputable bus converters, I decided against it even though I had the money (profit sharing by a generous employer) to pay for such an expensive venture at that time.

What I saw was actually frightening. The serious reconstructive surgery and awe-inspiring REINFORCEMENT intended to somewhat or somehow restore the strength of the original space frame must have added momentous weight and dangerous unbalance without achieving the desired results. Moreover, I could not even perceive a hint of anyone of the converters taking into account the inherent twisting moments of the vehicle in motion or during emplacement on uneven surfaces.

Considering the risks, effects, costs and benefits, my wife and I opted not to proceed with structure modifications and the installation of an additional slide-out living space. We also began to become conscious of not liking water leaks and a coach that could perhaps howl like an old English castle during travel. Instead, we decided to invest in extensive insulation (both temperature and sound), an energy efficient electric power plant and other luxury items. Moreover, we found and still find the living spaces in our coach not at all confining and exceptionally comfortable. It’s because we spent many hours in planning and implementing a layout that evokes the feeling of an atmosphere of open space within the constraints of limited dimensions. We never once had the desire to add floor space.

Christian Berlit
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Re: Slideouts
Mon May 18, 2009 8:49 am


Impressive first post, Christian. We're glad to have you with us and look forward to your participation. Don't ever hesitate to jump in and share your experiences.

I'm glad to see that you for your avatar added. Now I hope we will see lots more pictures of your Eagle in a Project thread soon.
Dale Houston
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Re: Slideouts
Mon May 18, 2009 9:51 am


Christian,

Welcome aboard! Lets hear more about your selection on the insulation for both sound and heat. I am just about ready to put the floor in my conversion and need to hear from everyone about floor insulation. I am pretty well convinved that we will spray the ceiling and walls but still need ideas for the floor insulation.
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Re: Slideouts
Tue May 19, 2009 12:33 am


Songman - thank you very much for your kind words.

Judging from your specific concern, NormaJean, you almost certainly have recognized that as an avid bus nut you will have to understand and apply seemingly arcane laws of Physics -- from sound to light and everything in-between. It’s humbling, isn’t it?

Yet, something wonderful happens when a group of people with an open mind as well as positive sensory orientation begin to solve problems via a board -- such the one from Eagles International -- and in fact discuss complicated issues and begin to solve problems. It’s actually called the “Mastermind” principle.

The concept of the Mastermind Group is not new. It was formally introduced by Napoleon Hill in the early 1900's. In his timeless classic he wrote about the Mastermind principle as: "The coordination of knowledge and effort of two or more people, who work toward a definite purpose, in the spirit of harmony." He continues ... "No two minds ever come together without thereby creating a third, invisible intangible force, which may be likened to a third mind."

The beauty of Mastermind Groups is that participants raise the bar by challenging each other to create and implement goals, brainstorm ideas, and support each other with total honesty, respect and compassion. When that happens, then “The Third Mind” at all times far exceeds the brainpower of any one of the participants.

With this in mind I am certainly not opposed to venturing into a discussion with you all about “Acoustical Materials” that can successfully be applied to the interior of a bus under conversion. This thread, however, focuses on the pros and cons connected with the incorporation of slide-out rooms.

So, is straying from the original topic acceptable?

Christian
Christian Berlit
El Paso, TX

He who has a why to live can bear almost any how. -- Friedrich Nietzsche
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Re: Slideouts
Tue May 19, 2009 4:56 am


Chris,

It would be best if you would start a new topic on insulation. That way it's easier to locate when someone does a search, also the discussion can stay on track. ;)

Everyones input is invaluable, that is the end result of the third mind! :) (I really don't have a clue, it just sounded good) :roll:

~Paul~
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Re: Slideouts
Tue May 19, 2009 7:07 pm


Nice posts Chris.
The problem I have after talking with Chris is that there doesn't seem to be three minds afterwards-(my 1/2 gray matter + his :lol: :lol: )
Keep up the good work Chris.
Hal
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Re: Slideouts
Tue May 19, 2009 9:08 pm


Well now , I just finished reading the post by Christian and I must say I am impressed Not only did I not understand what some of the words he used meant, "Iam of a simple learned it on the street kind of guy" but the way he put it made sense to me and after owning a motorhome with three slide's and finding it rather nice to live in it when you're sitting still. However when you were underway the wind noise and rattles made me vow to live without them. There is something to be said about owning a motorhome or a bus with slides when they were originally engineered that way. I myself am the first to say to each his own and that's how I stand on this . But heck where would we be with out good ole American ingenuity?
Andy Wright 68 Silver Eagle Model 5 8V92 #7481
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Re: Slideouts
Tue May 19, 2009 9:28 pm


This is a great topic to get several opinions on what works and what doesn't. I do not have any first hand knowledge of slides at all. I will say, it's beyond what I would be willing to tackle at this stage in my life. If I was in my 30's I give it a shot. A lot of engineering time has to be spent, even mock-ups, or other opinions from more experienced folk.

I think that very few people, Kentucky Steve is included, would be capable of such a task. It's not something for the faint of heart or pocket book I'm sure.

I have seen only one Eagle in person that had slides, and it was gorgeous. I did not get a chance to talk with George McConaughey at the rally about it though. It looked like it was pretty stout.

The structual integrity would have to be superior for it to even withstand loads from side winds, bumps, inclines and just plain driving under the worse conditions.

I know my wife would like the extra room! ;)

~Paul~
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Re: Slideouts
Tue May 26, 2009 6:02 am


Guys, I just went to Kentucky Steve's website and all I can say is WOW! He is doing a First Class job on his slides! I'm no engineer, but there has been many hours of thought, planning and building to get where he is. His work is meticulous! I'll bet you a can of your favorite beverage that when it's all said and done it will be the envy of many!

I guess I'm lucky, when I post on my website I get to see his updates as a follower, so that way I can keep up with his project. Otherwise I probably wouldn't remember! ;)

~Paul~
Becky & Paul Lawry
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